The Last Heroes' Guild The Last Heroes' Guild [OOC and Meta]

Since we are discussing magic I have a question. Will magic be like tools that serve a specific purpose (which is what I prefer) or will it be like so many characters I see, and it just solves problems? Example: a character who has the power to dispel spells (I think it is from one of Scripts characters). I find it a little OP and boring. Here is an analogy that may help clarify this: its like the difference of having a screwdriver (tool) and you need to figure out (possible solution) what the issue is and how to solve it with the tools you have as opposed to just having the tool fixes the problem whatever that may be. I think thinking of magic as a tool helps add a little depth to everything that happens. So sometimes we won't be able to solve a problem, and will have to pick our fights and so on. Admittedly, we need first a Sanderson to come up with a consistent and solid magic system. Any thoughts?
 
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Bernar said:
Since we are discussing magic I have a question. Will magic be like tools that serve a specific purpose (which is what I prefer) or will it be like so many characters I see, and it just solves problems? Example: a character who has the power to dispel spells (I think it is from one of Scripts characters). I find it a little OP and boring. Here is an analogy that may help clarify this: its like the difference of having a screwdriver (tool) and you need to figure out (possible solution) what the issue is and how to solve it with the tools you have as opposed to just having the tool fixes the problem whatever that may be. I think thinking of magic as a tool helps add a little depth to everything that happens. So sometimes we won't be able to solve a problem, and will have to pick our fights and so on. Admittedly, we need first a Sanderson to come up with a consistent and solid magic system. Any thoughts?
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I agree completely.
Maybe you could be the "Sanderson", since you have a very logical approach to magic.
In which case, shouldn't we have a "Sanderson" for everything, from races (@ChelonianCommander) to locations to weapons?
 
WiZ said:
I agree completely.
Maybe you could be the "Sanderson", since you have a very logical approach to magic.
In which case, shouldn't we have a "Sanderson" for everything, from races (@ChelonianCommander) to locations to weapons?
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That would be ideal. The reason why I prioritize magic is because races do not play such a huge role in problem-solving. Same goes for weapons. It is when you add magic to those that issues come up. I can certainly help with coming up with such system but it is a bit overwhelming to tackle by myself. We should all work on it. I like the coding idea that was brought up earlier. I think that should be included.
 
Awesome. I love that the creative gears can keep turning when I'm not around. Got some good chemistry going in the this group.

ChelonianCommander said:
If you have any questions about Nugs or Void Born just ask.
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If I'm able to get the Epic RP Forum set up then I plan to have an information sub forum with sub-forums for races, items, lands, etc. Just general information and lore that we can add to as we see fit. So I hope to see lots of information on these two races there. Including that cookbook.:D Also in answer to something else you said, "Nugs will definitely be a thing." They will probably play a key role in the very first story arc.

Madam Taure said:
More like the latter, so the more you unlock the more you get to understand/get accepted by/can handle the strain of magic/the lifestream/whatever we think of as a source or name.
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I like where you're going with the "behind the scenes" working of magic. I think this could add a nice adventure aspect to the RP. I can picture us as a group or maybe individual heroes going on adventures to unlock more in regards to the world of magic. Though we do need to consider how the "puzzle" of magic in the New World and the Old World are the same or different. And how much understanding in one world will carry over to the next.

I was also considering a theory that could help tie these separate world's magic together. If each world's magic is like a river or stream, then we could think of it like an actual river, except in reverse. Instead of the river dumping out into an ocean, it's essence or magic is pulled from an ocean. A universal ocean of magic where all worlds initially pull their magic essence from, though it changes to large degrees after entering that world's stream. And the key to unlocking teleportation could be a deeper understanding of this universal magic. After all, the magic to teleport from the Old World to the New World was powerful, yet worked exactly the same in both worlds. Thus, the magic did not pull from the stream of either world, but from that universal ocean of magic.

Is this making sense? LoL. Just an idea we can flesh out more.

I believe the Tyrant would really want to learn the secrets of universal magic and teleportation so that he could transport himself or his armies anywhere in an instant. It would increase his presence and power tremendously.

ChelonianCommander said:
That makes sense. It seems rather unique but it doesn't really say how magic itself works. Like is it going to be like Harry Potter series where magic is just there and only certain people can use it, or is it going to be like the Elder Scrolls, where everyone can use it, it's just that some people are inherently better at it then other and/or capable of honing their abilities with time, practice and talent.
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Okay, so now I'm pondering a way to tie these various magical concepts together. To answer one of your questions, I think everyone would have the potential to use magic. It's looking like magic is its own thing in a sense. Almost its own character sort of. It's not really a personal thing that people are born with.

Now, with Taure's idea, the key to becoming powerful with magic is unlocking its secrets, its past, its truth, its mysteries, etc, which requires physical work for the most part. You actually have to go on journeys and stuff to learn magic and become good at it. You aren't just born that way.

However, we have the dragons, @seaciel 's idea, and the @BardicWaffle concept, which I really liked.

The dragons and Seaciel's ideas can sort of work along the same lines. Just replace the concept of a magic core with magical knowledge. Meaning a lot of magical secrets that a person unlocks could potentially be passed down to other people without that person needing to go on the journey themselves. Not all magic can be passed on this way, but a decent amount of it. Meaning that particular races, especially races that live very long times like elves and dragons, start off better at magic because they have more information passed down to them and they also have longer lives to uncover more magical secrets and grow stronger.

BUT

things are a bit different in the New World. The Tyrant is extremely powerful in the arts of magic. He has uncovered many, many runes, secrets, books, tomes, and puzzles throughout the world. And then he destroyed them so that nobody else can learn them (except for those who have already learned them and passed them down through generations).

So now when people want magic they turn to BardicWaffle's source of magic: making deals with the Tyrant or his staff in exchange for power. This magic may even be physically represented with coins or runes or something. And it could be possible that the Tyrant has learned a magic that lets him create a corrupted branch in the stream of magic which is what these coins or runes pull from. A stream which he controls so that if these magic users rose against him he could revoke their power. As Seaciel pointed out.

With these theories working together in this way there are various ways magic can come about. Nothing is set in concrete yet so we can still work on it some more.

seaciel said:
The Nugs and the culinary witchcrafts may be needed to be constantly under watch (if such is possible) due to the fact they cannot be "monetized" for personal gains.
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The Nugs will definitely be under watch by the Tyrant. He wouldn't let any nation run completely free. Remember, the Tyrant is an NPC of sorts for now and completely controls the New World. We won't necessarily be fighting him any time soon 1 on 1. In comparison to us, he will be considered extremely over powered at this time. (which may change in the progression of the story of course) He has unlocked a great majority of magical secrets in the world and could probably just split the ground open and swallow a country whole. The problem is that this is a big world and for the time being he doesn't feel the need to travel across the planet to act against the Nugs. So long as they don't seem to be bothering anything.

He will keep a watchful eye on them via some spies, or animals, or magical means for now. Chances are, that is how he will see us and first learn of us. That may even cause some suspicion on his behalf towards the Nugs which may lead to more plot developments.



Dragon Painter said:
Okay, throwing together my key thoughts on dragons and what they are.

The center of a dragon is their Life Fire. I don't mean the literal center, but I mean it IS the dragon. Their life, their fire, their magic, their essence. This fire is encased in a special stone within their chest called the athanc, which is a protective shell around the fire. Once a dragon reaches their age of Twilight, or the beginning of their death, they make preparations. Most choose to die peacefully and let their fire burn out. However, some choose to have their athanc removed and preserved, technically living while their physical form dies. Most do not choose this, or at least don't remain in this state for long, as they will usually slowly fall in to madness.

In regards to their magic in the New World, I would assume it would react very differently to the new magic and environment, varying and going awry.

Their dragon form is their true form and therefore easiest for them to be in, while the human form is merely a facade and requires magic to maintain, though only a small bit of it.

As for how I picture them, a dragon has four legs and a pair of wings. A wyvern is two legs and a pair of wings. ^^
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Sounds good to me. I picture dragons being very magically educated. They may even be one of the few races that taps into some degree of the universal magic. That may be how this heavily-magic species exists in both worlds. Because their athanc pulls on magic from between the worlds.


WiZ said:
Hey, I'm really interested in this, now that it's got this much attention.
I was thinking my character could be a "Manifestation" of the life energy that controls magic. Basically what this means is that it's a spirit that can enter inanimate objects and enchant them, or bring them to life. A good example of this would be a rock golem or a treant or a a water spirit.
So, you think this type of magic would be possible?
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Most of that made sense, except the part about "life energy that controls magic". A little explanation on that would be cool, but otherwise it sounds good.
 
Bernar said:
Since we are discussing magic I have a question. Will magic be like tools that serve a specific purpose (which is what I prefer) or will it be like so many characters I see, and it just solves problems? Example: a character who has the power to dispel spells (I think it is from one of Scripts characters). I find it a little OP and boring. Here is an analogy that may help clarify this: its like the difference of having a screwdriver (tool) and you need to figure out (possible solution) what the issue is and how to solve it with the tools you have as opposed to just having the tool fixes the problem whatever that may be. I think thinking of magic as a tool helps add a little depth to everything that happens. So sometimes we won't be able to solve a problem, and will have to pick our fights and so on. Admittedly, we need first a Sanderson to come up with a consistent and solid magic system. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...

Yes. Yes. And Yes.

Being a magic user shouldn't give someone the ability to solve all problems. That's why I like the idea of magic as something that anyone can tap into. Anyone can go find a screwdriver and use that tool. Rather than being a "tool person" who just has every tool ever created shoved in his pockets but he was born with those tools.

All magic should have somewhat of a purpose. And perhaps that purpose was not decided by people, but rather by the magic itself. And we can tie this back into Taure's idea where unlocking the secrets of magic is a lot like learning how to use a tool. Just because you have a hammer drill doesn't mean you can use it. Believe me.:D

And sometimes we won't have the tool we need. Normally, in the Old World, we might be able to go on a journey to find that tool if we had the time. Here, in the New World, things are a bit different because a lot of magical sources have been destroyed.
 
Almighty.Person.Me said:
Yes. Yes. And Yes.

Being a magic user shouldn't give someone the ability to solve all problems. That's why I like the idea of magic as something that anyone can tap into. Anyone can go find a screwdriver and use that tool. Rather than being a "tool person" who just has every tool ever created shoved in his pockets but he was born with those tools.

All magic should have somewhat of a purpose. And perhaps that purpose was not decided by people, but rather by the magic itself. And we can tie this back into Taure's idea where unlocking the secrets of magic is a lot like learning how to use a tool. Just because you have a hammer drill doesn't mean you can use it. Believe me.:D

And sometimes we won't have the tool we need. Normally, in the Old World, we might be able to go on a journey to find that tool if we had the time. Here, in the New World, things are a bit different because a lot of magical sources have been destroyed.
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Exactly my view on it. I like your previous encyclopedic post too. We may also learn of the tyrant spying on us in some way, and begin a sort of psychological fight. Try to figure out how he observes us and when. What we want him to know and what we want to hide. Also do we speak the same language as the people from the new world?
 
Bernar said:
Exactly my view on it. I like your previous encyclopedic post too. We may also learn of the tyrant spying on us in some way, and begin a sort of psychological fight. Try to figure out how he observes us and when. What we want him to know and what we want to hide. Also do we speak the same language as the people from the new world?
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Ah. Language. That's a toughie. What do you guys think?

1. On one hand: Realism would dictate we don't all speak the same language.

2. On the other hand: If everyone is speaking a bunch of different languages it is going to be hard to communicate and could make things tedious. And, at the end of the day, we would just have find a way to speak their language so it would really just be like a speed bump.

Personally, I think either would work. If there are language barriers, then we would likely have to find magical ways to cross them because we need the ability to communicate with everyone for the sake of dialogue and moving the story forward.
 
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